May 17, 2026 — Page 3 Of 5

The Green Mountains Alternative to Michigan if Fuel is Too Expensive ⛽

Andy | May 17, 2026

I’ve been giving it more though on what summer vacation may look like if gas is unavailable or too expensive. I think $6 a gallon is a practical limit in my mind for the Michigan Trip – still quite a bit more than today – but things remain quiet uncertain with global oil markets. But what is the alternative? Maybe a quiet vacation in the wilderness closer to home.

National Forests are kind of nice because you can set up camp and stay 14 days no permit required. Indeed, I liked it when I did that last summer at the Finger Lakes National Forest during the second half of August. Many days just hanging out at camp, laying back in the hammock, smoking weed and drinking beer, cooking up good food of the stove, hiking or riding the mountain bike, not driving anywhere. Just relaxing.

Maybe that’s a good option this year if Michigan is too pricey with fuel. I could to the Green Mountains not too far from Bennington and set up camp for a week plus. Still have to head into town occasionally for ice and other supplies I use up. Or I could do the Finger Lakes again – it’s not that far from home in the grand scheme of things and outside occasional trips to Burdett for ice or Watkins Glen for recreation, additional and ice cream, it doesn’t have to be that many miles driven. Got to have ice to keep the beer cold. It is vacation, only so many compromises are warranted.

I don’t know I’m still pretty committed to Michigan regardless of the cost of fuel but things could change by summer, the world is such an uncertain place these days.

Grout Pond

| May 17, 2026

Tuesday May 31, 2016 — Grout Pond

Map: Green Mountain National Forest North

Hills Along Kelley Stanton Road

Andy | May 17, 2026

This is in the recently cleared area.

Saturday June 18, 2011 — Grout Pond

Hopelessness

Andy | May 17, 2026

I was reading one of those endless ads about serious depression and they said one of the symptoms of depression is hopelessness. Like so many words I’ve heard, I have a common sense view of what that word means but no real understanding of the meaning. So I thought I’d ask Meta AI to give me a description.

“Hopelessness is a feeling of despair, helplessness, and pessimism about the future. It’s a state of mind where someone feels that their situation is impossible to change or improve, and that they are trapped with no way out.

When someone feels hopeless, they may:

1. Feel a lack of control over their life or circumstances.
2. Believe that their problems are insurmountable or unsolvable.
3. Feel disconnected from others, like no one understands or cares.
4. Experience a sense of numbness, emptiness, or emotional pain.
5. Have difficulty imagining a positive future or finding motivation to make changes.

Hopelessness can be triggered by various factors, such as:

– Traumatic events or experiences
– Chronic stress, anxiety, or depression
– Major life changes or losses (e.g., job loss, divorce, death of a loved one)
– Feeling trapped in a situation or relationship
– Lack of social support or connection

It’s essential to recognize that hopelessness is a treatable condition. If you or someone you know is struggling with hopelessness, it’s crucial to seek help from a mental health professional, a trusted friend or family member, or a support group.”

With that definition out of the way, the next question in my mind is do I feel hopeless? In some ways yes, as in the short term I don’t see a lot of options besides saving and investing so I can retire early and build that off grid homestead out in the real wilderness. Yet it’s not an immediate dream – still nearly thirteen years away – but I save and invest every week and I’m constantly reading and learning.

I still feel in many ways trapped, stuck in New York State in my cold and miserable apartment. I do spend as many of my weekends as possible in the wilderness – state and national forest back country – yet it’s not the same and it’s now. And maybe it’s just a delusional dream not because of a lack of money or will power but because it doesn’t really exist. I mean I’ve seen a few both on YouTube and in person, toured that one back in college, yet all I ever see when I get another Zillow alert is another hideous suburban property covered with vinyl siding.

Everybody I know is buying that suburban house covered in plastic and saving it’s a good investment. Don’t you know homes appreciate in value. Renting is just pissing away money, but you need a place to live. But then I see the endless ads for plastic windows, roofersand gutters – not to mention kitchen remodels and new showers. As if I wanted to live in a place under constant construction with an enormous dumpster out back. It just seems like the typical suburban house is about buying more shit and ripping out and throwing away the old to the local dumping grounds across the river. Stock market is certain to be in the crapper at least for the next few years.

I think I’m playing the long game. But many say I’m playing no game at all. It’s all in my mind, it’s my mental illness speaking louder then reality. You’ll never escape New York State, you’ll work to your advanced age, stuck in that rundown apartment in Delmar, riding the city bus or taking your mountain bike to work every day. Year after year. You’ll be poor forever, as you pay one rent payment month after month as your building continues to rot away.

Yet, why settle for less when you can work hard, save and invest as much as possible, and build the off-grid homestead you really want with money you’ve saved and invested. Truth is if you buy land remote enough and build a simple enough structure it can be done. Equipment is expensive but money grows over time and you can acquire over time. Or rent for one time use. There are options besides the standard suburban home, whether it’s in a neighborhood that smells like cow shit or elsewise.

Camping in Green Mountains National Forest

Andy | May 17, 2026

Green Mountain National Forest Camping 🏕

Here is a full-screen interactive map, that uses the official forest service maps as a backdrop. You will need to zoom in to see the individual roads.

In the Green Mountain National Forest there are a variety of back country roads, offering primitive roadside camping.

Campsites are free to use, and have no facilities except for a fire ring and a pull-off from the road, and sometimes a site reinforced with gravel.
As noted below, some campsites have additional facilities.
Don’t make a mess of campsites, pack out any garbage left over.
Burn only dead and down trees, don’t bring in wood from out of state.
You can camp up to 14 days per 30 day period in Green Mountain National Forest — no permits are required.

Here is a listing of the campsite coordinates in a spreadsheet (Green Mountain tab). Please note, these coordinates are not exact as they are drawn based on memory.

Please see also information on dispersed, roadside and back-country camping in New York State, Pennsylvania and West Virginia.

The below descriptions of camping areas from the Green Mountain National Forest’s webpage, General Forest Camping.

North Half of the Green Mountain National Forest

Note: You must zoom in to see individual roads on above interactive map. Campsite locations were added by hand-digitizing and are not exact.

Austin Brook Road: There are three easily accessible campsites by Austin Brook on Forest Road 25 in Warren. They are all within 0.25 mile of State Route 100.

Bingo: Forest Road 42 in Rochester runs alongside a mountain stream; camping is allowed at designated sites only. These 10 campsites are available on a first-come, first-served basis. There is a limit of 10 people per site. Check the Bingo Brook bulletin board for designated site locations and other site limitations.

Downingville: There is one secluded site in a small clearing near a mountain stream on Forest Road 291 in Lincoln.

Fay’s Meadow: There are a few sites in an open meadow in Forest Dale. Please do not drive on the meadow because a farmer mows the hay from it. There is a stream for wading and fishing at the north end of the meadow.

Goshen Brook Road: There are a few campsites in and around an open area just beyond the turnaround at the very end of Forest Road 67 in Ripton.

Kettle Brook: A small meadow site at the end of Furnace Brook Road in Pittsford.

Michigan Brook Road: Forest Road 35 in Pittsfield provides many camping opportunities in the woods and along Michigan Brook. The road is not recommended for low clearance vehicles.

New Haven River: There are a few campsites next to the New Haven River at Emily Proctor and Cooley Glen trailhead, on Forest Road 201 in Lincoln.

Romance Header: A large meadow campsite at the end of Forest Road 224 in Forest Dale. A stream lies to the southeast of the meadow.

Sparks Landing: There is one site in a small meadow on Forest Road 233 in Lincoln. There is good fishing in Sparks Brook, which lies just south of the meadow.

Steam Mill Clearing: There is a large open field on both sides of Forest Road 59 at the Skylight Pond Trailhead in Ripton.

Texas Gap: These old fields and side roads on Forest Road 39 in Hancock offer many camping opportunities.

White River & Gulf Brook Roads: Secluded camping, open fields, and beautiful views are offered from the abundance of primitive campsites found along Forest Roads 55 & 101 in Granville.

South Half of the Green Mountain National Forest

Note: You must zoom in to see individual roads on above interactive map. Campsite locations were added by hand-digitizing and are not exact.

Branch Pond Road: Several sites on this road off of Kelley Stand offer good camping opportunities.

Forest Road 71: This forest road stretches from the old Somerset airfield to the Kelley Stand Road. Campsites can be found in various spots along the way, and along some of the forest roads leading off of Forest Road 71.

Forest Road 74: This forest road is a little less remote than other roadside camping opportunities. Off Vermont Route 9, it dead-ends a couple miles in. Campsites are found unevenly spaced along the way. This area fills up early as it’s one of most accessible.

Kelley Stand Road: Connects the towns of Arlington to West Wardsboro, traveling along an unpaved forest road. A handful of campsites are avaliable on this road, many of the sites along Roaring Brook are permanetly closed.

Old Job: Off Forest Road 30 there are a few camping opportunities; an open area along FR 30, and both an open field area and a site near Lake Brook at the end of FR 30.

Somerset Airfield Campground is a small primitive campground along Forest Road 71. There is a pit-privy and fireplaces in this field camping area. Also popular is Castle Brook Road, near the Deerfield River. This area fills up early, and is known for rowdy crowds but is good if you have a big camper.

Map: Green Mountain National Forest South